@tomdesoals: I don't quite get it though. And just read any car review of the blend between regenerative braking and hydraulic, then decide whether you want a computer deciding to regen as you roll off a drop regen braking is pretty much impossible on an ebike as it requires the use of a direct drive motor. Review: 2022 Norco Sight C1 VLT - A Long Range eMTB Maybe it's specific to the commencal frame design transmitting sounds? - Strong but very well-tuned power delivery While some frames will resonate more than others, the noise is otherwise normal, and it doesnt take long before your brain subconsciously ignores it. But overall EP8 offers more of a quieter and gentler hum than the whine of the E8000 motor, and its also quieter than the Bosch motor too. Let us know what those are so we can demand them! Canyon Spectral:ON tucks 900Wh battery in new full carbon frame In comparison, you can get a Polygon Mt Bromo N8 with a Shimano EP8 motor for $7,899 AUD. Indeed Specialized actually built the new Levo around a mullet setup with a 27.5in rear wheel, in order to shorten the chainstays. No, not at all. I have this motor. Can someone make a bike with 50% - 100% assist? - Low-drag performance Discover EP801 series | Shimano MTB One is a Haibike Fat-Tire with a Yamaha Drive, the second is an absolutely brilliant 40lb (including battery) DIODE from LaMere Cycles in the USA. Thanks to a new seal structure and gear design, drag is reduced by 36- percent, getting much closer to the normal pedaling feeling of a traditional bike. Not the first time Shimano has screwed the pooch with recent launches. FEATURES Supports sleek frame design Same mount as current BT-E8035 The rider feels more connected to their bike as they naturally modulate their own power to navigate slippery roots and urge the bike over large boulders while the EP8 drive unit matches their intuitive power application instantly and seamlessly leading to better traction and effortless steering. Both the E-TUBE PROJECT app and the E-TUBE RIDE app are now available to download from iPhone or Android app stores and are fully compatible with Shimano EP8. This is a real review with details and pros and cons. Weve noticed this while pedalling along forest double tracks and on the road to and from the trailhead, but its also apparent when sprinting along faster sections of singletrack. HOME EP8 delivers up to 85 Nm of torque, a 21-percent increase over the STEPS E8000 motor platform. No mention on the worldwide recall of the motor due to issues? I think we lost grit when we all got smart phones. This is a Class 1 e-bike motor with a maximum assist level of 20 MPH. The freewheel is still in the (regular) rear hub so when you're not pedaling, nothing in the motor-bottombracket assembly should be moving, isn't it? That rattle would drive me bonkers. Our batteries are renowned for keeping you out on the trails and riding further. Perfect? The three EP8 bikes weve tested all have sub-440mm rear centre lengths, which is quite a bit shorter than the 471.5mm rear centre on the Giant Trance X E+ with its much bulkier Yamaha motor, for example. In terms of improvements, EP8 is marginally lighter (300g) and smaller in volume (10%) over the old E8000 motor. So this one article, about this one e-bike, says to you that ALL e-bikes lack refinement and therefore aren't worthy of you gracing them with your holy ass? SM-CRE80-R. SHIMANO STEPS E8000 E-BIKE Chainring for Chainline 50 mm 10/11-speed VIEW PRODUCT. I can concur with the range, it's not as good as I expected. Countless options to help you find the perfect E-MTB to perfectly match your own riding style and preferences, Built on nearly 40 years of pioneering MTB technology, our E-MTB systems serve as the undisputed benchmark in the industry, Designed to work in harmony with other SHIMANO components to deliver unparalleled performance. capacity longer. Merida was the first to release a 2021 eBike running an EP8 and we've actually already ridden it in this video.For 2021, Merida has added the EP8 a larger 630Wh Shimano battery and improved the . Currently, I own two e-bikes with a new 2022 Moustache Samedi 26 Fat 4 with the Bosch Motor on its way. and The Shimano EP8 battery is 26% more capacity but the range is only 16% more. Its easy to modulate via how much pressure youre putting through the cranks and the power delivery is progressive, giving it a very natural feel as a result. Its worth noting that Bosch motor is only compatible with Bosch battery options though. For 2021, Merida has added the EP8 a larger 630Wh Shimano battery and improved the wire and cable routing to make it a little neater. According to Shimano, the EP8 motor offers a 36% reduction in drag over the old E8000 motor, and were inclined to believe that claim. I have a gen 3 and it's totally quiet when coasting . That makes it tricky to work out how much assistance youll be finishing your ride with. What is the range of the battery? If you aren't climbing steeps and requiring the torque, you would get way longer distance. The STEPS EC-E6002 charger is included. No, but the best on the market IMO. If riders prefer the additional support provided by boost mode or they plan to tackle next to impossible climbs, they will appreciate the greater bike control even with maximum power delivery in boost thanks to the new algorithm. I love the progression of Ebikes! I have no personal experience riding with pedal assist but when I hear the high whiz from the motor I think that would drive me mad too. Well, maybe, but he also chucked 20kg dead weight in his bag to try to make things right for you. Overall it is a very refined system though. Most brains will be capable of doing this, as the noise in question isnt actually signalling a fault with the motor. I get under 3 hours in eco, so I guess it's taking up more than 150 W per hour on average. Shimano STEPS EP8 Motor and 630wh Battery. Climbs really well and descends like a beast. Instead of a single assist ratio for each riding mode, the new algorithm constantly calculates the ideal assist ratio for the situation. you should ride slow with a good cadence. Shimano Cues - New 9/10/11 speed lower tier drivetrain components. . If thats the case for you, start at Level 5 and work your way down a notch at a time. As they say, power is nothing without control. That would be awesome to do laps on. Like their . It also responds a fraction quicker at the pedals, and delivers more overrun power when ratcheting the pedals over technical features up a climb. It is the most underrated comment ever on the pinkbike. Heat dissipating materials, increased surface area in the case, and a refined heat management algorithm improve heat resistance, allowing more torque to be applied even as the conditions become more challenging. What this article says to me is no wonder people make fun of mountain bikers. Range and power testing of different motors - EP8 What is the best electric mountain bike motor in 2022? Shimano vs Bosch In comparison, Shimano motors can be paired with third party batteries, and that opens up greater flexibility for bike designers (see the Orbea Rise and Pivot Shuttle for example). Aim for a cadence between 70-90 RPM for maximum efficiency and response from the motor. Standard Range Test: "R200" Standard Elevation Gain Test: "R300" 70W Rider Power 200% support of the motor: 140W Total Weight: 100 kg (Spectral:ON CFR: 22.2 kg and Rider: 77.8 kg) RANGE DONE RIGHT Range matters. Fitness hasn't a big effect because of all the muscle weight to motor has to carry but doesn't assist pedalling. Rattling and lack of update to the battery monitoring is a no go for me, I would just upgrade the battery to the new 620s if i could fit it. ON CFR with a 720Wh battery is 21.84 kg, 610g lighter than its 630Wh battery-rocking predecessor. For a lighter pedal feel than the E8000, the one-way bearing has reduced its rotational resistance, creating a free play. Dont be so lazy, put in the work and suffer a little bit! That is, spme pretension or a clutch like system. The EP8 motor and 630Wh battery are both known quantities and we can probably work out how far it will go based on other bikes, but it's an interesting omission nonetheless. Shimano Steps Battery shop the largest and most affordable! I'm 56 with a long term knee injury. SHIMANO STEPS Integrated Type Battery for Down Tube (630 Wh) Maximum Torque This allows you to limit the maximum torque, with 10 levels of adjustment from 20 Nm to 85 Nm. So, when the sensor senses a negative elevation gain, the dynamo kicks in to recharge the battery. Continuing a theme for electric . From what I get from the article, what would actually bother me more is how it kicks in from a standstill or trackstand. While I am at the age/account to have one, I couldn't imagine riding longer than my 630W battery lasted, i don't think i would be able to walk for a week. I've never heard the rattling noise that has been posted in the early reviews - the motor is super quiet, so it looks to me like much ado about nothing. Thank you for the info, so still king of the long travels is Levo - 700 battery + Levo SL with range extender. The EP8 drive unit shape more smoothly integrates with new e-bike frames for improved ground clearance and a more compact overall package. While the motor is both more sensitive and more powerful though, Shimano has done brilliantly to offer usable control of that power. What's left is just a plain old mountain bike with a weight around 14kg. When new the last bar of charge corresponds to roughly 15-20% charge, but over time this becomes 5-10%. Alongside the launch of the new EP8 motor, Shimano has increased the battery capacity to a mega 630 Wh. The ability to customize the boost is very useful, with Shimano's app you can dial it in to your preferences. It's a powerful unit with a huge reach, but it has a little problem: it rattles when riding downhill or, simply put, there is no power on the pedals. Generally on bikes we spend so little time braking that regeneration would be a waste of effort. Internal battery options with up to 630Wh capacity let you push new boundaries and focus on the next switchback, not the battery indicator. In addition to those weve tested, youll be able to find Shimano EP8 on the Santa Cruz Bullit & Heckler, Marin Alpine Trail E2, the Commencal Meta Power, YT Decoy,Pivot Shuttle and Mondraker Dusk. Plus integration looks like shit on those Nox bikes. If speed and maximum power output is less of a concern though, switching into the factory Eco mode is a sure-fire way to get more ride time expect range to double from those figures above. The Bosch motor produces the same 85Nm peak torque output as Shimano EP8, and it offers a similarly drag-free ride quality beyond the 25km/h cutoff due to the motor decoupling from the cranks. Stab happy!". View your system settings, assist levels and ride metrics via a 1.6 (inch) color LCD screen for easy on-trail reference. You still have the three basic assist modes: Eco, Trail and Boost. Furthermore, the range estimation is more accurate in our experience too. A downside of the 2.2 motor is that it is noticeably draggy above the 25km/h cutoff though something we experienced during back-to-back between the Levo and Canyon Spectral:ON. . The MY21 model also features an updated build kit that. 900WH - 97,2 km 2.132 m elev. My take away besides the obviously pro/con talking points was the weight of the bike. Bailey's Crossroads, VA 22041. EP8 delivers up to 85 Nm of torque, a 21-percent increase over the STEPS E8000 motor platform. Just got my first 29er. Then we'll fix that for you. That Shimano response was pure gold. Personally, were ok with downshifting and spinning our way up a steep incline its better for the health of your knees, and its likely better for the health of the motor too. Contrast that with the recently released Vitus E-Sommet VRX with EP8, 630Wh battery and similar travel and attitude for 5,199, . THIS WEBSITE USES COOKIES TO IMPROVE YOUR USER EXPERIENCE. Shimano's EP8 motor will be specced on a range of top brands 2021 eMTB's including the majority of Merida's ebike range which benefits from the extra performance of the EP8. The Ride The confident geometry, with its agility and stability is better than ever, and for the 2022 line up, we've upped the travel both front and rear, while keeping . I own the Levo SL, and it is the most refined ebike I have ridden so far. Also worth noting is that you can create two riding profiles, which you can alternate between via the menu and push-button on the display. Did some rides on a scott e-genius 920(2020) and my biggest one I did was a 115 km with 2000 meters of ascent ,19 km average speed,all in the eco mode and riding some rocky terrain with some tarmac ,fire roads ,very mixed terrain ,and I did got impressed with the power and the range ,didnt got me so tired on the legs its most a cardio ,but dont put more power on them and no more battery capacity,cause it wil make them almost a dirt bike :-((. "- Only five power bars for charge level.". Seems quite useful for when pushing the bike up these impossible climbs. Its a little different though, with Orbea detuning the motors power and assistance to improve efficiency so it can use a smaller and lighter 360Wh battery. Its also a very quiet motor when pedalling. More power, less weight, even more efficient and the biggest battery Shimano offer. In addition to the challenge of having remaining battery life displayed as five bars, the range estimation tends to drop quite quickly during the final two bars. Maybe in a next generation they can implement an optional solution analog to what we're already seeing f bicycle chains. I mean, one of the most beautiful things about the bicycle is how efficient and capable it is of traveling long distances under our own power. Occasionally it can feel a little peakier compared to EP8, but for the most part both motors are easy to get used to within a few rides. I have never posted a comment here on pinkbike, however this article in particular is hitting a nerve. I rode the engine too, the thing is the engine is super quiet once you charge on the pedals, and you've got that annoying rattling noise as soon as you are on the freewheel and cruising down the trail Shim is working on it from what they said. Riders can customize multiple settings through the E-TUBE PROJECT app, giving greater control over how they want their bike to ride. Why so delicate, bro? View More Close. This bike also gets a Shimano drivetrain but it's upgraded to the SLX range with some Deore sneaking its way in, taking the place of the cassette and chain. Uh oh, another one E-triggered. Maximum power output sits at 500W, although the continuous power output is set at 250W like most motors. While the increased power certainly grabs most of the headlines, we reckon its the compact form of the Shimano EP8 drive unit that offers the greatest advantage over its competitors. The maximum rider support was raised to 400%, compared to the E8000's 300%. The updated Trail mode is brilliant, and the option to fine-tune each assist mode is a welcome feature for achieving the desired feel while maximising range. You also need a special key to release the battery from the frame, which were not fans of, at least for a mountain bike anyway. A bike that weighs almost half as much as the rider. I run the previous version steps e8000 and I think it's brilliant. I rode an e bike and suffered a little bit yesterday. Having spoken with other long-term EP8 and Bosch Gen 4 users, it would appear that for many riders its a non-issue. Here youll find three sliding scales for each of the three assist modes (thats Eco, Trail and Boost). The new EP8 motor is specced on the Heckler, and the MX wheel size option features Reserve carbon wheels front and back. Concaved button-shape shifters make it easier to switch between Eco, Trail and Boost modes. Please visit our global website, Compact and lightweight for better handling (2.6 kg), More ground clearance for technical trails, Smooth, direct power to ensure youre always in complete control, Responsive, allowing for a smoother cut-off when pedaling above 25km/h, Quiet motor lets you enjoy the trails without distraction, Durable and weather-resistant for riding in all conditions, Customizable power and battery management with the E-TUBE PROJECT Cyclist Cyclist App, Streamlined mount position provides easy visibility, Connect wirelessly to the E-TUBE PROJECT Cyclist Cyclist or E-TUBE RIDE app, Retains 60% max capacity after 1000 full charge cycles, Quick charging to get you on the trails sooner, Internal mount options for sleek frame designs, LINKGLIDE drivetrains have been engineered to be more durable while delivering smooth shifting, Shorter cranks help prevent pedal strikes to maintain smooth cadence and motor assistance, Available crank lengths: 160mm, 165mm, 170mm or 175mm, Light and strong chainrings with DYNAMIC CHAIN ENGAGEMENT+ for improved chain retention on bumpy terrain, Chainring teeth options: 32T, 34T, 36T or 38T, Equipped on a wide variety of brands and models. Upon a little digging on the internet, it appears that this functionality is only on offer for Garmin users. New batteries recently released by Shimano are available for EP8, including two 630Wh battery options, the external BT-E8016 and internal BT-E8036 battery. this dude knows how to write a review, well done. Three battery options including 900Wh Wheel size: 29" only Travel: 160mm front, 150mm rear 64-degree head angle 78-degree effective seat angle 462mm chainstay Weight: 25.6 kg. NEWS - Tuning options are simple and effective On top of that, Shimano also appears to be cool with brands building their bikes with non-Shimano batteries. As well as being smaller, lighter and more efficient, the new EP8 drive unit also packs more punch with up to 85Nm of torque, bringing it up to speed with the latest power plants from Bosch, Yamaha and Brose/Specialized. High level of water-resistant performance (IPX5) . quieter(+) smaller(+) lighter(+) more power(-) battery range(=). Eco set to low and all climbing done slowly in good dry conditions with a light fit rider and low rolling resistance tyres? if you success increase speed. When they start looking (and weighing closer to regular trail bikes then I'll consider. Can I give 100 upvotes please? Pickup is faster too, with less hesitation between pedalling and torque being delivered to the rear tyre. The low profile EM800 display takes up minimal space next to the stem, featuring a crystal-clear screen with colour-coded graphics to easily identify which assist setting youre in. SHIMANO STEPS Integrated Down Tube Battery Mount With Key Unit Mount, SHIMANO STEPS Integrated Down Tube Battery Mount Without Key Unit Mount, SHIMANO STEPS Integrated Down Tube Battery Mount, SHIMANO SERVICE CENTER Side-by-side, the EP8 motor is slimmer around the belly and so offers a skerrick more ground clearance. > Canyon has released a lighter, longer-range Spectral:ON eMTB with downtube capacity for a 720Wh or a 900Wh battery. Additionally, Shimano produces a smaller and lighter 504Wh option, which is also cheaper and helps to bring the complete bike price down see the sub-$8K Polygon Mt Bromo N8 for example. I'm honestly flabbergasted that people complain about it tbh lol. It's a similar level of feeling to Gen. Also a big improvement over the prior motor is that the EP8 freewheels easily, so on flats or downhill you can blast away without motor resistance. Vitus E-Sommet powers up self-shuttle runs with all-new - Bikerumor 720 WH - 77,7 km 1.681 m elev. I like to see a dynamo recharging system when the bike starts to coast downhill. More juice (and more travel) makes the new enduro eMTB heavier than before. the rattle it because the sprag bearing that used to be used in most motors has been replaced by DT swiss style star ratchet drive rings. Have had my Norco Range LVT with the EP8 for a week and have noticed the noise, maybe once? Unfortunately frenchies and Germans are not masters of marketing. . Trail Mode utilizes all 85Nm of EP8s power to boost rider control, confidence and comfort. However the motor operation itself is fabulous, smooth, powerful, feels natural when you ride, you can cover ground like crazy in this thing. You can improve efficiency by limiting the maximum torque, though it is still possible to get maximum power out of the motor by pedalling at a higher cadence, so you wont necessarily get more range by limiting torque. With that said, all my riding is tough climbs and steep descents, without an e-bike would be walking up a bunch of it. Meta Power with EP8. The touch points are all up to typical Shimano standards of quality, though we would like to see improvements to the functionality of the display unit, notably having battery life shown as a percentage. Really? From my experience range is determined by climbing and cadence. They need to get their old skunk works team back together and gain real world feedback before promoting vaporware. Ebikes are cool but not quite refined enough to jump in yet. I tried to find out the cause of this. But to give you some numbers, weve consistently achieved around 1,500m of climbing during our 30-50km test rides. Though the new EP8 motor is claimed to be more efficient than its predecessor, there is of course more power too. > A single 630 watt-hour battery provides between 30 to 60 miles per charge, depending on conditions. Thats given us plenty of saddle time to compare and contrast the new motor not only with E8000, but also with the latest Bosch Gen 4 motor and the Brose-manufactured 2.2 motor in the new Specialized Levo. I have the EP8 on a Commencal Meta Power. I weighed around 70kg and cadence was between 70-100rpm with mostly lowest gear and mostly asphalt. Component categories and series of GRAVEL, Component categories and series of LIFESTYLE, Component categories and series of E-BIKE, Your smartphone to cycling computer on the bike, SHIMANO bicycle ride data collection/analysis service, SHIMANO AGAINST THE TAMPERING WITH E-BIKES, California Transparency in Supply Chain Act. Anyone knows what's are those white (ish) shoes the reviewer is using on some of the pics? Appreciate the level of detail in this article, good work. Chuckle. So paired with Shimano's biggest 630wh battery it ensures the Bullit is fully equipped for . Shimano EP8: More power, more range. Think of the classic couple with fit 100kg male with big backpack and 60 kg female with smaller backpack. @tomdesoals: Ah, thanks I get it. Filter. Still, given the lengths that bike and drivetrain manufacturers have gone to stealthify mountain bikes over the past few years, we found the noisy EP8 motor to be infuriating during the first few rides just as we did with the Bosch Gen 4. > Shimano EP8 Review | Long-term living with Shimano's latest e-MTB motor The Purion controller is vastly simpler and easy to read, but it looks cheap and its bulky, making it an awkward fit with brake and dropper levers. EP8 Technical Features Drive unit weight: 2.6 kg compared to 2.9 kg for DU-E8000 Case material: Magnesium 10-percent less volume compared to DU-E8000 Maximum torque output: 85 Nm Maximum power output: 500 W 36-percent reduction in drag Greatly reduced driving noise, quieter than DU-E7000 The EP8 (EP800) drive unit delivers smooth, direct power to ensure you're always in complete control while experiencing a natural ride feeling. system so what I'd like to see is if in a real world ride the increased battery capacity and reduced drag of the EP8 and 630wh battery lead to significantly greater range and vertical climbed. (7000km ridden so far). BAE Systems, Inc. is the U.S. subsidiary of BAE Systems plc, an international defense, aerospace and security company which delivers a full range of products and services for air, land and naval forces, as well as advanced electronics, security, information technology solutions and customer support services. REI Bailey's Crossroads IMO Shimano bikes are good,but they are 2 steps down compared to Specialized and Bosch. I doubt that, based on my experience with the E8000 and 504 Wh battery. What settings you end up will depend on your personal riding style, and your expectations of range and power output. It is MUCH less powerful, but there is no rattle, no weird cut off, no jerky pedal action. As for the test on range, do one in Boost and one in Trail. E5003 Cycling Computer With the Spectral:ON for example, which has very short chainstays and a relatively slack seat tube angle that puts your weight further over the rear axle on steep climbs, it helped to dial down the Assistance Character (to 6/10), the Maximum Torque (to 78Nm) and the Assistance Start (to 4/5) to soften the bikes power and acceleration. Can't see the equivalent of a ribbed chainstay protector happening. Ive only charged 2x. The thing is though, you do actually get used to that noise. I tested a few Merida bikes with Shimano motor and they have some bugs in first versions,quite annoying stupid things force you to reset the bike sometimes. When youre descending down the trail, the volume and resonance are amplified. On my older gen Bosch motor with a 500wh battery I can get about 30 miles out of a battery charge if I only turbo up the steepest climbs and do the other bits in low/mid power settings (and I'm about 100kg's / 16 stone which sucks battery). Introducing the new Focus Jam2 and Sam2 your perfect match. The biggest change has been with Trail mode, which now gives you access to the full 85Nm of torque if youre pedalling hard enough. Plus the prices will drop as the tech becomes cheaper and can be offered at lower prices. I found this beauty as an example: The reviewer weighs 55kgs. Set as my REI. That's worse to, because 20kg dead weight doesn't contribute like 20kg of normal, muscle-laden body mass. Yeah you're right but I feel like the biggest factor is still rider weight. "Unquestionably, Shimano has the cleanest and sleekest display integration on the market". With the introduction of the new Shimano EP8 platform, the bar has been raised again with significant gains in the areas that matter to e-mountain bikers the most: Leading power-to-weight ratio, with 21-percent more torque (85 Nm) available in both TRAIL and BOOST modes in a smaller and lighter package featuring a magnesium drive unit case Breakthrough assist algorithm that delivers the right power at the right time, organically matching the riders efforts allowing them to tackle the toughest terrain with full support while also extending range Designed with customization in mind allowing riders to personalize the character of their bike in new ways. So many issues that can be simply solved by not having a motor. The frame itself is unchanged, but an adjustment to the receiver hardware allows the bigger 630Wh battery to fit inside the same downtube cavity. But please don't anyone kid themselves that it's as much of a work out as an analogue bike, if there was no mechanical advantage over analogue what would be the benefit. While weve certainly been impressed by the power, ride feel and tuneability of the Shimano EP8 system, how does it stack up against the likes of Bosch and Brose/Specialized? Shimano release the new EP8 eMTB motor for 2021 | BikePerfect 2 bars left on the Shimano display. If you are disabled and need a motor on your bike in order to ride, I understand. Make it 100 mile range, and I'm in. Probably more than some rattle. - A little more overrun on technical climbs would be swell The new EP8 computer display (SC-EM800) shares many external similarities with the SC-E8000 display, but with new features including a more capable chipset, expanded compatibility with third party computers, and the ability to select two different custom ride profiles.